From Idea to Building a Product Empire with Michelle Webber

Welcome back to Proof It’s Possible! In this episode, we are diving deep into the world of natural health, wellness trends, and the sometimes messy side of personal growth. We are unpacking our real-life experiences with everything from natural deodorants to parasite cleanses. Michelle Webber, founder of SONDR, a vegan and cruelty-free deodorant brand shares her entrepreneurial journey with us! Tune in to hear:

•  How Michelle Weber went from event planner to founder of SONDR, a vegan and cruelty-free deodorant brand.
•  Why switching to natural deodorant is not for the faint of heart—and how Michelle turned that challenge into a business.
•  The surprising role accessibility plays in clean beauty—and why Michelle is determined to make it mainstream.
•  How crafting unique, intentional scents helped Sonder stand out in a crowded market.
•  What it really takes to launch a purpose-driven product line from scratch.
•  The importance of community, connection, and staying grounded on the entrepreneurial path.

Would you switch to SONDR? Share your thoughts with us—we’d love to hear!  DM us on Instagram @dayle_sheehan_designs & @jamiedfrancis! See you next time!

This episode is sponsored by our Ultimate Girls Trip! Be sure to go to www.proofitspossible.com for more info.

Connect with Michelle:

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For More Information:
• Proof It's Possible Website
• The Ultimate Girls Trip Instagram

Dayle:
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• LinkedIn
• Website
• Interior Design

Jamie:
• Instagram
• Facebook
• LinkedIn
• Website

Transcript

Jamie (00:00.609)
Hi everyone, welcome to Proof It's Possible. Today we have a very exciting guest, Michelle Weber, and she is the founder and creator of SONDR, which is a vegan and cruelty-free deodorant brand and expanding. So potential new products coming soon, but I'm personally obsessed with her deodorant. It is top-notch and like...

you know, chemical free, safe for pre-teens, safe for my kids, safe for me, and works so good, smells delicious. So tell us about, just a little bit about your entrepreneurial journey.

Michelle Webber (00:40.574)
Mm-hmm. You could say that I've done a little bit of everything throughout my life and from political work, because that's what I did my degree in, to flight attending to everything and started off my entrepreneurial journey in events as a wedding and event planner in the Okanagan in BC. That was a great way to start. It was, you know, really risk-free, low overhead and we're a very busy wedding destination. So it really taught me a lot of kind of the basics of business in terms of

you know, the customer service and just the general runnings of a business. And from there moved into another kind of event, hospitality business, a mobile oyster bar. I really wasn't looking to start another business. I was doing those two simultaneously as well as working full-time in nonprofit. And it just kind of naturally happened. I'm really big believer, a big believer, pardon me, in ethical.

cruelty-free products and I started digging into that little bunny logo on the back of the bottles and learned that it was really just kind of a marketing ploy. So I started doing tons of digging and slowly switching all of our products over it, which takes a lot of effort. But deodorant was one that I could not find that was actually cruelty-free, that actually worked, didn't cause like a horrible irritation and was healthy. And I was working, you know, 18, 19 hour days, literally running in the 35, 40 degree heat in the Okanagan.

was a deal breaker. had to work. typical female, ADHD.

Jamie (02:13.473)
Questions I have is like, how did you go from being like, I need some deodorant that's cruelty free to being like, I'm gonna just create it myself? how did you even know where to start?

Dayle (02:26.341)
Yeah, exactly. I knew you wanted to do this.

Michelle Webber (02:26.57)
Yeah, that's the type A entrepreneur ADHD brain is I can't sit and do one thing at a time. So my husband and I, we're watching a movie, I'm typically like on my phone doing something or on my computer. And I just started looking at like looking for a deodorant and looking, what does it take to start a deodorant? Where are the manufacturers in Canada? And all of a I just looked at my husband and said, I think I'm starting another business. And he said,

Of course you are doing what? then like cruelty free deodorant. He's like, of course you are. So now I need to use that natural crap. And I said, well, yeah. And now he loves it more than the name brand that shall not be named that he used to use before that was full of chemicals. And so really I'm just that person I leap before I look and I know that I can find the answers. Like we have the internet. It's amazing. You can answer. I knew I didn't want to make it myself.

Jamie (03:21.142)
Yes.

Michelle Webber (03:24.558)
I didn't want to start trying to create potions. don't have a chemistry background. So I looked for manufacturers here in BC or Canada because it was kind of just post COVID like 20, well, no, was right during COVID. Very few answers and responses. People were busy making hand sanitizer. I started out as manufacturer at Edmonton and worked really hand in hand for three years. And then, you know, unfortunately they ended up going out of business after 25 years.

Jamie (03:44.223)
Good.

Michelle Webber (03:53.27)
right before we launched in business. It was a hard way to start, but and they kind of rushed the manufacturing process and get the product out the door. It was a very large order to make sure that we could come to a good price point. So there was a lot of like peddling, figuring things out, fixing things right from the get go. And now our product is even better than it would have been originally. So yeah.

Jamie (03:55.883)
goodness.

Dayle (04:16.788)
So are you currently the manufacturer of it then or who does it now? found somebody.

Michelle Webber (04:19.726)
We only brought it in hopes for now. Yeah. I keep saying for now, but the more that we work, the more I think there's an opportunity because one of our big pillars is accessibility and inclusion. And inclusion goes beyond race, culture, sexual orientation, gender. Inclusion to me, because of my background and because I have a sister who has a disability, is people with disabilities. And there's a lot of people out there with a cognitive disability who

have aspirations, they want to have these careers that we want. They want to be able to be creative and do awesome things. They don't want to be a greeter at a big box chain store or sort of recycling or be a janitor. And there's not much beyond that. And so there's a lot of people out there who have cognitive disabilities, but this amazing ability to focus and do things that people, neurotypicals for instance, wouldn't be as good at, like formulating cosmetics products or body care products and coming up with creative solutions. So.

The more we think about it, maybe we want to keep it in house and create a really cool ability to hire awesome, different minded people who can do things differently than we would. Yeah.

Jamie (05:30.945)
For sure. I love that.

Dayle (05:31.082)
That's so good. How did you come up with the smells? Because I will say, I was like, no, I can't do that. And my reason was, is because my luggage got lost a few Christmases ago. So I was relying on all my mom's products for like a week. And I had to wear her natural deodorant that was repulsive. Like, yes, no, no, this is a long time ago.

Jamie (05:55.199)
the time and it was not Sonderbrand so let's just

Michelle Webber (05:58.722)
Obviously.

Dayle (05:59.356)
And so I kind of had it my head that I was like, this is terrible. I'm never doing this. Like I'm sticking with the won't name brand that I'm comfortable with. And then when I finally met you and like got a bottle of, or like a stick of your deodorant, I was like, this smells delicious. It works. It's not all like slimy wet, like it had the right texture. was all the things that I was looking for. And I'm like, okay, she's, she's actually

crack the code, like this is different, this is a totally different thing. And so how do you come up with those delicious smells? Because I bought the travel pack recently to just smell every one and see what one I like the best. And they're all equally as delicious. Like I wear the man's one or the like male scent. It's so nice.

Jamie (06:36.673)
Mm-hmm.

Michelle Webber (06:42.602)
yeah, that's how we've changed the name actually to Cedarwood Whiskey so that women don't think they can't use it because they love it. It just kind of, I would say it smells like British Columbia, that fresh, kind of outdoorsy smell. So our, one of our slogans is make clean mainstream. Zero shade to the essential oily girls out there who love essential oils. I hate the smell of essential oils. Not my jam.

Dayle (06:48.008)
Yeah.

Yeah. no. Yeah.

Jamie (06:53.077)
Lourley.

Dayle (06:58.527)
Yes.

Dayle (07:07.402)
Mm-hmm. Amen.

Jamie (07:07.553)
Yes.

Michelle Webber (07:08.382)
nothing against it, good for you, that's awesome. I was the girl before I started learning about what's in our products that would reach for, like smell everyone and pick the best smelling one. I didn't care what the ingredients were. Like it wasn't my, it wasn't where I was. I'm a very smell driven person. I want to smell good. I love coconut. So our first smell is coconut jasmine. so yeah, my favorite too. I love anything coconutty, right? It's like in the summer, it matches summer. In the winter, it makes you feel like you're on vacation.

Jamie (07:27.297)
Still my fave.

Dayle (07:28.394)
wearing it to me.

Jamie (07:30.113)
Well, you're wearing it right now.

Jamie (07:37.397)
Exactly.

Dayle (07:38.056)
Exactly.

Michelle Webber (07:38.478)
So it was very important to me that we are a naturally derived plant-based brand. was not my first priority to be 100 % all-natural product. It needs to be non-toxic, healthy, safe. It had to be cruelty-free and it had to be good for the environment. We have science. It's 2025. We have some brilliant minds out there who have created amazing things that are very effective, very healthy, even safer than some of the things that we find in nature because no.

100 % natural does not mean 100 % all good. So for me, it was important that mainstream people want to reach out on the shelf and have a product that they're used to. So that same kind of deodorant they've been using that isn't greasy or you don't use, you know, like weird ways of wearing deodorant or that you have to reapply every five seconds or that smells different than you're used to. So we just kind of really nailed down our deal breakers.

And then went into kind of smells and I'm always driven towards those like tropical smells. And I'm like, okay, Michelle, we need to also think of people that aren't you, that are purchasing deodorant. And you know, we really made some shifts and things like that. Like our Santa would vanilla lime. Um, we ended up moving it over to all natural fragrances. So somebody who really is, I don't care what you say, I don't care what your certifications are, how healthy you are. I want all natural. There you go. So there's an option for that person as well, but really trying to kind of like.

hit the spectrum, like fruity and tropical, a little bit more earthy, and kind of just listening to what people say too is a big one.

Dayle (09:07.69)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, well that's great, because they smell so good.

Jamie (09:13.291)
Well, and like, why don't you just share with the listeners what the current four smells are.

Michelle Webber (09:18.542)
So number one, was the first smell we came up with is Coconut Jasmine. Again, I love all things coconut and I like to smell like the beach. Number two is Pineapple Bergamot. So a little bit more citrusy, kind of fresh, zesty and energizing. Number three is that more kind of earthy essential oil forward scent. So sandalwood, vanilla and lime. But that vanilla kind of gives it a creamy sweet scent. And the most recent that we came up with.

Jamie (09:45.515)
Hello.

Michelle Webber (09:48.012)
that was called Mansmell, and it was called that because when we were doing our research, we would ask all of our friends, we had a list of questions about your priorities really, and one of those questions was, what smells do you enjoy? And women were really detailed, like I like soft linen floating in the breeze with a hint of lavender, whereas every man, I don't care what walk of life they came from, whether it was a judge, a lawyer, a construction worker, it didn't matter. I don't know, well, you know, like Mansmell.

So as a new oak, we call it the man smell and it's cedar wood, is like we blend our scents, right? So our cedar wood is an essential oil, but we also use botanicals, like natural botanicals and safe European standard synthetics to come up with like the mainstream scents that people enjoy. So the other scent is whiskey. So we found that so many of our women that use Sonder fell in love with it, but they were like, is it different? Can we use it? okay. So our next round of packaging, we'll call it cedar wood whiskey.

Dayle (10:45.0)
Yeah. Good.

Jamie (10:46.079)
I love them all. They're all so good. Like if you get the combo pack, like I like to get, you get to use them all for like whatever season of life you're in. So some days I'm like, Ooh, I feel coconutty. Like it's a beautiful day outside and I want to do that. And then other days, yeah.

Dayle (11:00.328)
Yeah, it's almost like perfume. That's how I've been using mine. I'm like, is there? Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Michelle Webber (11:02.862)
On the list, people have been asking for it, like a hair and body kind of thing or something maybe, And on your note, Jamie, those combo packs, so people are looking because they want to try a few, our dealers have a two-year shelf life. So if you want to get multiple to try and find your best scent, it's not looking to use them in three months or else they'll go bad. So you've got two years to go through.

Jamie (11:07.889)
yeah, that's a good idea.

Dayle (11:24.99)
Well, that's what we need to do.

Jamie (11:25.153)
And they last a very long time. I've noticed they last forever, which is so nice because you don't have to replenish them as often, but then you feel really good about the value that you're getting, because it's like, price matches the amount of time that you're going to use it for. So I really appreciate that.

Michelle Webber (11:41.804)
Best business plan in hindsight, but that was the goal. Accessibility was important. I have a single mother and if our focus on clean and natural and healthy products had been what it like back in the day when I was a teenager needing to start using deodorant, she would have been gutted not being able to buy me the $35 deodorants because she couldn't have. And so at $19 for our full size that lasts well over three months, I feel proud and happy doing that because I know that it's accessible to most people who are looking for those kinds of

Jamie (12:09.985)
Totally, So for anyone who's listening who's like, you know, got this dream on their heart and this idea that they've come up with or you know, something that they're just passionate about, you were looking for natural cruelty free deodorant and you couldn't find what you were looking for. If there's somebody like you listening, can you give any advice on how you have like what you needed to do as far as your mindset shift to just go for it?

Michelle Webber (12:10.956)
Yeah.

Michelle Webber (12:39.81)
I think that's the first thing is I've, luckily for me, I've never been a person that asks a million people's opinions. I think that's number one. Maybe if you really feel like you need a second opinion, find that one person who's your closest, but keep in mind, they want to keep you safe. So they might not have the best answer. And so if you are truly like passionate and driven, just make the decision. Don't ask people's opinion. Tell them what you're doing. I've never, you know, you read those.

Jamie (12:55.681)
Mm-hmm.

Michelle Webber (13:07.982)
books or you hear the podcast and you hear, yeah, so many people told me, what are you doing? What are you doing? I can tell you, I've never had one person say that to me because I didn't give them the choice. I'm doing this. I'm fully aware of my capabilities. What's that?

Dayle (13:18.056)
Right, yeah, you didn't open the door to that conversation. You didn't open the door for the conversation to even happen. You just told people what you were doing confidently.

Michelle Webber (13:26.286)
Yeah. And so everyone is my biggest cheerleaders. And honestly, it's none of my business what they say behind closed doors. I could care less. So if you're cheating on my face, I'll take it at face value. Yeah. Listen to yourself. Honestly, do the research, but don't wait until your ducks are in a row. Don't wait until you know every little thing. You'll learn it. And cause a lot of things that you think you've learned beforehand, you're to learn differently as you're doing it. So just go for it. Start learning, people, look for experts. Just do your thing. Yeah.

Dayle (13:33.608)
Exactly.

Jamie (13:33.761)
Totally.

Dayle (13:49.885)
Exactly.

Dayle (13:53.896)
Yeah. Well, and not to minimize like other people's businesses, including my own, because mine are service based businesses, but I do, I feel there's like a level of hardness to a product based business that you, there's even more to learn. There's shipping, there's packaging, there's formulating, there's developing, there's manufacturing. Like there's all the other steps that, you know, if I'm just providing a service, I can email you out the document or I can have a phone call and make you the website. Like,

Michelle Webber (14:09.101)
Thanks.

Jamie (14:11.04)
Mm-hmm.

Dayle (14:23.804)
I don't have to find the right plastic, you know, to like send it out in and I don't have to figure out how to ship it across the world and do all those things. Cause you are a worldwide company. Like you, you ship to Europe, you ship wherever people are wanting your products. So you have figured out exactly figured out stuff that is very hard.

Jamie (14:26.795)
Mm-hmm.

Michelle Webber (14:26.892)
Yeah.

Michelle Webber (14:40.17)
We actually had our first order from last week. Yeah, coming from a same back as you Dale, like of service business. Big learning curve that continues on. almost are, we'll be three in November. And even still it's always evolving because you know, the world evolves. So terrorists and different kind of rules and laws and costs going up and down. It's definitely.

Jamie (14:44.478)
There you go.

Michelle Webber (15:09.448)
learning curve and you just go with it and keep learning.

Dayle (15:13.556)
You're amazing.

Jamie (15:13.919)
I love that. Okay, so I know you have some very exciting things coming up. So can you tell us, we don't want you to like do the big reveal, but can you just give us a little bit of what we can expect from Sonder in the future?

Michelle Webber (15:26.894)
Of course. So I've always been the belief I'm not going to keep just throwing new products out there because we want them to be intentional. Like why are they here? Why are we putting them out? Is it because they're on TikTok and they're trending or is it because it's a product that will be evergreen? you know, when COVID hit and I had my two event businesses, my husband said, you need a pandemic proof company.

And I feel like everybody always needs deodorant. So that's the mindset we've been sticking with all along. We're not just going to keep dropping products. So yeah, so we've got three exciting things happening after, you know, not a ton of newness in three years. We've got a new scent, a couple of limited edition things. So in early July, we'll have our fifth permanent scent. And that is honestly based off of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of our customers really excited feedback.

Jamie (15:48.225)
Man.

Michelle Webber (16:16.332)
So that might be bit of a hint, but that'll be our new set will be launching in July. Shortly after, like really shortly after we've got a new product variant coming out. And I'm not telling you guys this on purpose because we have a launch plan. And then finally, we don't have an exact date yet, but late summer we have a brand new product line. That is going to be very exciting. So lots of stuff going on. It's keeping us all on our toes and

Jamie (16:36.289)
Woo!

Michelle Webber (16:43.882)
Again, every new product that comes out, it's a whole new learning curve. So yeah, lots of super exciting stuff.

Jamie (16:50.955)
That's amazing. so what is your, let's just throw it out to the universe. What is your dream for Sonder? If there's anybody who's listening that can maybe be that missing puzzle piece or anything, just lay it out on the table. What is your dream? Either, you know, like an immediate dream or one that's 10 years down the road for this business.

Michelle Webber (17:08.43)
Okay, good one. Like I said, our slogan is make clean mainstream. So we want to be mainstream. We want to be the brand of deodorant of X product, X product, X product, whatever that might be, whatever comes out, that when you see our logo, you know that what we are promising you and what we are saying is true. And so we want to be in the major stores. We want to be that one that people reach to, that they know they're getting a great value, they're getting what they've asked for, and they can feel

proud of their purchase because they know that they're purchasing an ethical product that will not sell out as we grow. So we put a clause in our shareholder agreement that we will never sell Sonder, if we do sell Sonder, to a parent company that doesn't adhere to the exact same standards as we do, and we listed them out. So no matter how big Sonder becomes, and that's the goal is to be mainstream, so in those nationwide, international...

Jamie (17:44.053)
Mm-hmm.

Jamie (18:04.427)
Mm-hmm.

Michelle Webber (18:04.962)
worldwide chains, whatever, we will always maintain why we started.

Dayle (18:11.986)
Amazing. And in the meantime, if you are a small, medium or large size store, who this feels in alignment with you, reach out to Michelle because she would love to do a trial of selling in your store. Get this to more people.

Jamie (18:12.129)
I love that.

Michelle Webber (18:13.443)
Yeah.

Michelle Webber (18:27.276)
Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie (18:29.225)
Michelle, can you tell everyone, any listeners, how they can reach you?

Michelle Webber (18:33.294)
Mm-hmm. So we are in about 130 stores across Canada and a couple in the US as well. And you can also order direct. So our website is sondorfresh.com. You can either order directly through us, free shipping on orders over $50, or if you scroll right to the bottom, our store locator map is there. We're also on Instagram and Facebook, at sondorfresh.

Dayle (19:00.296)
Amazing. Okay, I have one more question for you before we let you go. What would you say you were one of our Ultimate Girl Trip girls? And what would you say is your proof? Yes, is but our last one she attended and we loved her. What was your proof it's possible moment or what is yours in your story in your life on that weekend? You know, any anything you'd like to share with us?

Jamie (19:00.309)
Amazing.

Michelle Webber (19:02.371)
Yeah.

Jamie (19:10.731)
There is, it's not past tense.

Jamie (19:15.883)
Yes. Yes.

Michelle Webber (19:29.966)
I feel like I have so many, but I think just on that weekend, I didn't go in there realizing how impactful it would be and how your connections can happen just like that and how when you make your squad or your group, anything is possible. And then that...

You can't be, you have to be picky. You can't just settle for your group of friends. So if you have friends who don't have the same aspirations and dreams, don't dump them, but you know, differently because the two of you, especially, we went out for dinner and there is Sephora there and you made me go and get like six photos in front of that Sephora to manifest what I want and how we want to grow.

That moment amongst many, many others made me realize, you know, if you pick your group, right, and you keep going and you'll quit and you share and you're open and vulnerable, because that's hard. Just let yourself get there and keep surrounding yourself because. You know, I got back from that trip and it was like a definitely a cracking open kind of moment. And I got sick. You guys saw I got sick for about a month and I was really not able to push and grow. Like push my brand and we.

things tipped and went crazy while I couldn't even do anything to push it forward. So I always say I'm listening to the universe and it tells me when I'm going in the right direction. And so, you know, there was a few conversations that were had that weekend and I was like, my God, anything is literally possible with the right people in your corner and the right mindset as well. So yeah. Yeah.

Dayle (21:05.288)
We love that.

Jamie (21:06.889)
Yes, yes to all of that. And I love that the orders just are pouring in for you because it's the best deodorant on the planet. we're so excited for you. What's that?

Dayle (21:13.864)
It is. He's changing the world with it. Like it's a whole new thing in my opinion. Yep.

Michelle Webber (21:17.058)
So grateful for you guys.

Michelle Webber (21:21.918)
One pit at a time, two pits at a time.

Jamie (21:24.836)
One smelly armpit at a time. Okay, well thank you so much for taking the time to meet with us today. And if you haven't started using Sonder, go on her website right now and order yourself. Do yourself a favor and order some. We loved having you.

Michelle Webber (21:26.868)
That's it. yeah.

Michelle Webber (21:40.3)
I appreciate you guys so much. Bye you guys. Bye.

Dayle (21:41.524)
Take care. Thanks for listening, everyone. Okay, we're out. We're done. she left. That's okay.

Jamie (21:42.639)
Bye Michelle.

Jamie (21:48.958)
it's left.